We consistently follow our own path - an interview with Hanna Bajer

We prefer slight insufficiency to visual excess. Such spaces calm us down. Our designs are orderly, because that's who we are. We design interiors in which we ourselves feel good," says Hanna Bajer, an interior designer who, together with her husband, runs the highly regarded Warsaw studio BajerSokół Team.

The interview was conducted by Arletta Liro (OKK).

Arletta Liro (OKK): You are a member of the Association of Interior Designers, whose main goal is to build the stature of the profession and popularize good design practices.

Hanna Bajer: The association was founded in 2018, among studios with a proven track record. Of course, we all knew each other beforehand. We must have liked each other and wanted to spend time together, because working for the Association is an absolutely pro bono activity. I was one of the initiators and founders. Today I am just a regular member for the reason that my husband, Paul Sokol, is serving another term as president. As a result, I had to take over some of his responsibilities at the studio.

Arletta: What requirements do you set for new members?

Hanna: The basic prerequisite for admission is a five-year degree in a field of study. There are no exceptions to this rule. This is very strictly observed by us. We only accept people with experience, a minimum of five years. We want to have experienced interior architects in the ranks of SAW, not those who are just starting out. Our goal from the beginning was that the profession of interior designer should be practiced by people who are properly prepared for it.

Hanna Bajer and Paweł Sokół

Arletta: So interior design graduates from the Academy of Fine Arts like you and Paweł?

Hanna: Not exactly. There are interior architects in the Association who graduated from the Polytechnic.

Arletta: Towhat extent do you feel like artists yourselves, and to what extent do you feel like designers?

Hanna: We try to combine both areas very closely. On the other hand, we do not identify with the popular image of an artist who is careless, laid-back, late for meetings. Paul and I are on time, punctual, we deliver projects on time. The well-worn stereotype of the "creator" annoys and irritates me. We refute it with our attitude. As graduates of the Academy of Fine Arts, we naturally think like artists. Artistic aspects are very important to us. But at the same time we make sure that technical drawings also represent the highest quality. In my opinion, in this profession it doesn't matter whether you have a diploma from the Academy of Fine Arts or from the Technical University.

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Arletta: With Paul you are a team both in private life and at work....

Hanna: Nooo...yes! All the time (laughs) As artists, we share a common aesthetic, identical taste. We have been together for many years, we go to the same places, go to the same stores, hotels and so on. We hang out with each other non-stop. We have the same interests, we are friends, and basically the most important thing for us is this private relationship. Although we like similar things we never run projects together. This is because we are extremely different in terms of character and temperament, so we decided long ago that each of us works independently. Here our paths do not cross. Of course, we support each other emotionally, we talk about work. We do not, moreover, act in two. At the moment there are eight of us. For an interior design studio, this is already a large team. If you want to maintain the authorial character of the project, you need to keep an eye on it all the time, and above a certain number of employees it starts to get out of control.

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Arletta: That's what sets you guys apart - the authorial approach! The quality of your work is evidenced by numerous awards....

Hanna: Unfortunately for me, such is my character, awards do not motivate me. I'm motivated by failures and I only dwell on them. A failed project, a conflict with an investor - these are things I attach importance to. To rewards not necessarily. I worry when something doesn't work out. And every designer has more difficult collaborations. Interior designer is a profession of relationships. That's what's most difficult about it.

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Arletta: TheBajer - Falcon Team website is striking in its graphic simplicity, but also in its power. One feels the power of your personalities here. What does such an image of the team communicate?

Hanna: At this stage we want to do the kind of interiors we are interested in. This means that if there is an investor who wants us to design something that is not the same with our aesthetics or our beliefs we simply won't undertake it. We carry out those projects that remain in harmony with us. Naturally, it will not always be the same interior. After all, we use a different color scheme in each project, even though we use our favorite range. We introduce different forms, textures, use different furnishings... We consciously changed the name of the studio from "EXIT" to the one derived from our names, to signal that we are interested in author's interiors.

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Arletta: You don't realize other people's fantasies. Like established painters or musicians, you express yourselves in your own language....

Hanna: That's right. We don't do "custom portraits".

Arletta: You design both interiors of apartments and houses. Do you have an influence on the shape of the solid?

Hanna: This is, of course, a matter of the investor's awareness and at what stage he turns to us. But this awareness is changing in favor. We have many mature investors, especially now. Those who know that it is necessary to come to the interior architect early enough....

Arletta: At the foundation stage?

Hanna: Definitely before. Our clients show up at the studio before the building permit is issued. Generally at the architectural concept stage. So that they can consult with us on the projections in time. Then our work and the design of the massing proceed in parallel. This is the most correct way to create interior architecture. Good implementation is the result of cooperation. Everyone must feel comfortable with the process and the relationship. Both the investor and the architect. It is an arrangement from which everyone must come out satisfied.

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Arletta: "Black", "Dark brown", "Warm Grey", "Ivory", "White" - these are the titles of some of your projects. You are fond of circling around color subtleties, within quarter tones....

Hanna: I design with color. With color and texture. I think Paul does the same. This is something we left behind after the Academy of Fine Arts. We are very sensitive to color - four thousand five hundred shades of gray! In fact, we choose colors a little differently. In our interiors there is very, very much seemingly the same, and yet ... completely different color. Everything is black, for example, but not exactly, because the nuances are very much there. Even sometimes we get tired of it already (laughs).

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Arletta: Doyou happen to assist investors in terms of art selection?

Hanna: If they don't already have art objects then yes. But a project with art with a capital "S" is yet to come. Soon, hopefully, we will start a project in which art will play first fiddle.

Arletta: The cuboid of theinterior designed by Bajer - Falcon Team itself becomes an economical in expression "painting" played out on several planes in the space. The verticals of monolithic furniture and curtains emphasized by the folds in combination with the levels of smooth planes of islands, table tops, sofa surfaces bring calm and balance....

Hanna: We prefer a slight insufficiency to visual excess. Such spaces calm us down. Our designs are orderly, because we are like that. We design interiors in which we ourselves feel good. Pedantic characters translate into aesthetics. We create environments that are conducive to relaxation. In our opinion, home is a place that should give a sense of calm, not stimulate. Hence the subdued color scheme and ascetic forms. One investor pointed out that there are no books in these interiors. It's true, there are none on top of them. Of course, two or three beautiful albums are ok, but why keep dozens of books in plain sight? For me, it is visually disturbing. It doesn't allow me to stay with my own thoughts. Just like displaying china and other collections. We avoid breaking the mold and unnecessary decoration. On the other hand, we like to use various types of cladding. It is extremely rare to see a traditional wall painted with paint. Most often we finish it with wallpaper or panels: veneered or lacquered, tiles or stone. The interiors we design are not minimalist, although at first glance they seem so. They are characterized by a frugal form, but also by the richness of the materials used. There is a lot of detail, textures, shades in them. This is what makes them not to be considered "minimalist".

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Arletta: In this kind of approach to design, every element, every form has meaning. For example ... the radiator, necessary after all in the interior. A well-fitted one will help enhance the effect, while an ill-fitting one can nullify the aesthetic expression of the whole....

Hanna: Speaking of radiators, we use only one model of wall-mounted radiator in our projects in addition to the floor-mounted, or channel-mounted ones - Niva by VASCO. Its strength is that you practically can't see it! Especially if the shade blends with the background of the wall. Therein lies the wisdom of the person who designed it, that he did not try to attract gazes with his "work". She did not create a decorative form, but designed a simple, functional object. This is the best way to solve an essential function. Because, after all, a radiator will never be a painting - much cooler is simply art on the wall. Niva was conceived in such a way that it does not pretend to be anything it is not. It cannot be considered showy in the traditional sense of the word, and this is its greatest advantage. It remains neutral in expression, you can match its shade perfectly to the wall color, and it has good proportions. It is optimal.

Arletta: Finally, I would still like to know what you do when you are not working?

Hanna: We look at a lot of art. Painting and sculpture accompany us on a daily basis. Other visual arts also interest us a lot. We like to go out, go to an opening, see an exhibition. This gives us the greatest pleasure. Most often we subordinate our vacations to such events. And besides, we also like to party (laughs).

Arletta: So you are so-called city animals?

Hanna: Yes, definitely yes. We rather not wander in the woods. Unless it's a short walk. If we go out it's mostly to cities and to watch art and then go to a party.

Arletta: Do you have your masters in interior design?

Hanna: No. We consistently follow our own path.